DU is predicting duck production to be above average

[Chad Manlove]

Meanwhile, we CONTINUE to lose valuable grassland habitats at an alarming rate....Where is the concern for the loss of breeding habitat? Let's get fired about grassland loss!

Chad -- to what are we losing the habitat?

I know that at the Delta Waterfowl meeting in Memphis I attended they did not some much speak of loosing habitat that currently exists. They did talk about crappy %'s when it comes to breeding success. Hopefully, DU can continue to buy habitat, although it seems to becoming tougher and tougher in the US due to farmers not wanting to sell and Canada not having a CRP type program to date, and Delta can concentrate on trapping and hen house efforts. The two combined might acheive some results!

Chad, will DU ever work hand in hand with Delta and allow them to trap and use hen houses on large %'s of DU owned land? I hope to see it happen some day...

Redeye,

DU is not terribly concerned about "buying habitat". You are correct, it is very expensive. We have purchased properties in the past, but the bulk of those purchases have been in Canada. We own only a handful of properties in the United States, less than 20,000 acres (all occurs on the breeding grounds). However, DU will continue to focus on habitat protection with conservation easements. We can PROTECT grassland and wetland complexes forever through the easement program. It's a very effective and efficient use of DU dollars. For only $75-$100 / acre, we can protect nesting habitat forever. The rancher still owns the land and can manage cows accordingly, but best of all, the ducks benefit! Ranchers are standing in line for this program right now. Demand is very high for conservation easements.

DU has worked with Delta in the past (mostly just on research projects where the 2 organizations have helped fund a high priority waterfowl project). DU doesn't own much land in the US. So trapping on DU lands is not a high priority for DU or even Delta for that matter.

[Chad Manlove]

98. I will not bash DU.
99. I will not bash DU .
100. I will not bash DU.

Shew, Mr. DU biologist please tell the magazine to not hype it this year, loss of credibility could be at stake! Long term average my booty. If last year was any indication, the AHM is broken and its a Yugo and parts are not on the way. Next hing I'm going to hear is the harvest numbers from last year based on HIP surveys, now that will be a laugh. So far I think i've heard around 151 reasons for the South's poor duck seasons, when its simple, there ain't no ducks! ITs a Burmuda Duck Triangle between here and the PPR, every here they are many and they just vanish into thin air around St. Louis I guess.

Gumbo,

Just like any other season, everything hinges on the Spring Breeding Pair Surveys and May Pond Counts. The USFWS conducts the surveys and compiles the results. The results will be available in less than 2 weeks. Maybe you'll get your wish........a reduced duck season.

[Chad Manlove]

They cry that crap every year about this time. To get the people pumped up on the prospect of having a great season. I'm here to tell you that for at least the past 5 to 7 years there have been $hitty duck seasons. Yeah, Yeah, everyong knows someone who has been killing ducks, there are exceptions to every rule, but the overall consensus was that duck hunting sucked for the past several years. I don't believe ANY hype of a bumper crop of ducks for the upcoming season. Come post season there is always some line of bull$hit being thrown around about WHY there were no ducks in the south. I have heard that DU dumped corn in Illinois to hold them up there (crock of crap) I have heard that we didn't have the weather (another crock of crap) I have seen more ducks here in NOVEMBER about 8 years ago when there actually WERE some ducks than I have seen ever since. I have heard that they were swimming aroung on unfrozen ponds and lakes in Minnesota in January (another......). When duck season gets here I will be out there regardless of what some idiot predicts. This same group of morons need to get their heads out of their arses and quit predicting stuff that apparently they have NO idea about. As far as us losing wetlands....this is my response. Why doesn't DU make the most of what they DO have by implementing some sort of predator control. F*CK PETA who gives a $hit about them anyway. Certainly not any of us! If you, this great entity that is DU, are going to be pushed around by a bunch of wimpy vegetarians, then I will send my donations to an organization that won't be pushed around by them...namely Delta waterfowl.
Good day!

Dutch,

The last 3 years have been below average for MS duck hunters, BUT to say the last 5-7 years have been crappy? Give me a break! Where have you been? 1998, 1999, and 2000 were great duck seasons....we had some cold weather events during those winters and had plenty of birds to hunt. 1999 was one of the largest fall flights on record....everyone experienced above average conditions. Can we expect to remain at those high levels all the time?....No. Semi-Drought conditions returned to the prairies and duck production has declined since 1999. Breeding Pair surveys suggest 20% reduction in breeding populations.....so yes, we have fewer ducks than we experienced in the late 90s.

DU will not get involved in PC at this time. How many ducks do you think a plowed soybean field will raise?? ZERO. Why worry about trapping if you've got no habitat to trap? DU will continue to focus on habitat protection in this region. Until the habitat base is protected, DU won't get involved with trapping predators. It has NOTHING to do with PETA. Who cares what they think? DU is not concerned with their animal rights positions. Our membership is based on hunters, not PETA. Our goal in this region is to protect habitat that provides long-term benefits for nesting ducks. Without habitat, PC is a mute point.

[RebelYelp]

here's my take and i've been saying it a while, let DU get the land, easements, or whatever it takes to either acquire it or get the landowner to protect it. That's what they're good at. Then... let DW manage it so the land can be more productive than what it currently is. The fact of the matter is, the past 3 years, the South has not hurt the duck population in any way, if the ducks #'s ARE there, where is the excess that we SHOULD have.

Jake

[Chad Manlove]

here's my take and i've been saying it a while, let DU get the land, easements, or whatever it takes to either acquire it or get the landowner to protect it. That's what they're good at. Then... let DW manage it so the land can be more productive than what it currently is. The fact of the matter is, the past 3 years, the South has not hurt the duck population in any way, if the ducks #'s ARE there, where is the excess that we SHOULD have.

Jake

Jake,

An "excess" of ducks is not based on what the south does or does not harvest during the duck season. An "excess" of ducks depends on duck production on the breeding grounds. With plenty of water and grasslands on the breeding grounds, there will be an "excess" of ducks. Semi-drought conditions have returned to the prairies for the past couple of springs. As a result, breeding pops have declined since the late 90s.

[eastwoods]

Chad if say say 99 and 00 were good then you must have had a robo because the numbers were not there which is why we are where we are today. DU will say we have ducks and we won't again just like always.

I don't really care, their myth actually improves things for the ducks so shame on nobody.

[Chad Manlove]

Chad if say say 99 and 00 were good then you must have had a robo because the numbers were not there which is why we are where we are today. DU will say we have ducks and we won't again just like always.

I don't really care, their myth actually improves things for the ducks so shame on nobody.

eastwoods,

I don't own or hunt with robos. So it must have been something else. How about record breeding populations???

What do you mean "the numbers were not there?" In 1999, breeding populations were at RECORD levels....43.4 million birds. In 2000, total duck abundance was 41.8 million birds (still 27% above the long-term average).

This past year (2003), the total duck population estimate was 36.2 million birds (only 9% above the LTA). As habitat conditions on the breeding grounds have deteriorated somewhat, breeding pops have dropped the past couple of years.

[webfoot]

Chad, thanks for the information, and keeping us informed.

[mottlet]

Come on Chad, we all know that you've got spinners hanging from trees, spinners sitting on poles, spinners floating on lily pads, no less than twenty-eight spinners in one decoy spread. And that's only when you're duck cronies aren't hunting with you, when you all get together, it's more like forty!! It's fine, just go ahead and admit it!!

I wish that during the 99-00 and 00-01 seasons I knew as much about killing ducks as I know now. Because they're were birds everywhere. Even as a stupid college kid hunting by myself for the first time, I killed birds. Maybe not as many as Chad with his forty-three spinners, but certainly more than a punk like me should have killed. Goes without saying that this was all on public land.

mottlet

ps--hey chad, when do I get to go on one of the great spoonie shoots?

[Unlucky Ducky]

blah, blah.......blah, blah, blah.

[RebelYelp]

Chad,

my wording may have been wrong. I wasn't suggesting that becuase Southern hunters haven't been killing birds that there should be a great amount more. The same #'s of ducks would most likely be killed, just in a different capacity (i.e. the hunters where the ducks were killed the difference). However traditionally in some of the nothern states, the #'s of hunters is lower, and with state and federal regulations and limits, you might think the overall harvest dropped. To the other part of my previous post, at some point i just feel that we should do more work to enhance the land we've already got to make it more productive. There may be plenty of this going on that you dont' hear about, and if there is, just forget i mentioned it. Thanks for the help and info.

Jake

[eastwoods]

Well there must be a big difference between 43 million and 36 million because those 7 million dumb ducks must have all flew to AR and MS and were slaughtered by spinners and Chad's group.

The duck pickers in my areas saw a 50% decrease in number of ducks in 99 over 98 and again in 00 over 99. Those numbers just don't equate to what DU pushes every year. And the trend downward continues.

DU will always say there is a bunch of ducks to raise money to provide habitat and that is OK I guess. I would tell the sportsman that there aren't any ducks and please send your money.

So Chad tell us how many DU said came down the last 2 years?

[Ringbill]

I know better than to say anything. Maybe I don't.

The issue isn't and should never have been that predator managment can increase nest success and, based on recent research, perhaps increase ducking and brood survival. The issue for many waterfowl scientists, and hopefully for the waterfowling public, is what the investment is gaining and for what time periods the gains are realized.

Many seem to think DU's grassland easement program is only meant to tie up land in some kind of cover, and much of that land has poor nest success. In some respects this is true, because nest success is poor in most areas of the prairie pothole region. However, grassland on the landscape should be the first place we start. Roundup ready soybeans are a good example; with bean prices skyrocketing this year much of eastern South Dakota (grasslands) are being drilled into beans. It's all about providing a nest site first and foremost.

Regarding Predator Management - no one, and I rekon not even Chad, deny the fact it has potential to increase nest success on the scales demonstrated. However, the one thing that Delta Waterfowl has not done, and it's critical in my opinion, is provided a peer-reviewed study that examines the annual cost of PM for a 'noticable' gain in ducks in the fall flight or the bag. I don't know how one would define 'noticable' gain, maybe a 10% increase in mallard recruitement or 1 more duck in the yearly bag. The data exist to model this...but we haven't seen or heard of it yet.

Which brings us back home. In the absense of better information, it hurts people like me to see dollars going to PM that can save grasslands. Science needs to provide a bit more direction on large-scale PM, at which point we can decide if it's worth going full on. In the mean time, grasslands suffer the plow.

I know I will regret what I just said, but I had to say it.

Josh

[Chad Manlove]

Well there must be a big difference between 43 million and 36 million because those 7 million dumb ducks must have all flew to AR and MS and were slaughtered by spinners and Chad's group.

The duck pickers in my areas saw a 50% decrease in number of ducks in 99 over 98 and again in 00 over 99. Those numbers just don't equate to what DU pushes every year. And the trend downward continues.

DU will always say there is a bunch of ducks to raise money to provide habitat and that is OK I guess. I would tell the sportsman that there aren't any ducks and please send your money.

So Chad tell us how many DU said came down the last 2 years?

Do you understand that these are not DU's numbers? These are numbers generated by the US Fish and Wildlife Service. DU reports these numbers because our members and other interested hunters want to know.

The Fall Flight Index was discontinued after the 1999 season. I have no idea how many birds migrated south the last 2 years. I can give you numbers regarding the breeding populations of waterfowl but that does not translate into a Fall Flight estimate. DU has not reported fall flight numbers since 1999.

If the numbers showed a 50% decrease in breeding pops resulting in a 30 day/ 3 duck season, then that's what DU will report. It's not based on fundraising as many would like to believe. Liberal seasons have increased the hunter's expectations. Maybe it's time for a more restrictive duck season.

[Po Monkey Lounger]

I still recall '99 as a very good year for the Po Monkey and the rest of the Wooly Swamp boys. We darn near wore out Blue Room Boy's chessie that year ----that dog must have retrieved well over 500 ducks that year---I think he was in need of doggie therapy by the end of the season.

You boys that don't remember many ducks in 1999 either must not hunt very much or have selective amnesia to support your anti-DU diatribe on this thread (as if DU controls the annual duck migration ).